collection of hauma hamiddha's scattered posts

Indra & Thor

> IEists refer to indra’s slaying of vrtra as similar to IE myths of a
> hero who slays a dragon.

Actually there are different issues here: The dragon myths and the
demon myths- both of which in my opinion can be traced back to the
PIE period and may even have homologs in the cultures that
diverged even before PIE. The dragon myth,involved the slaying of a
serpentine dragon and is attested in the Indian stream not by the
vR^itra myth but by the ahi myth. Ahi was clearly serpentine entity
quite distinct from vR^itra. Ahi emerges in the Iranian world as Azhi
Dahaka who was slain by Thraetaona with the aid of Verethraghna. Thor
slays a similar serpent termed Jormungand in the great battle of
Ragnarok. Zeus’ battles with Typhon are the greek version of this.

The demon myth involved the slaying of more anthropic entities
: dAnu, vR^itra, namUchi, kUyava and pipru fall in that category. We
see them as the jotunar slain by Thor in Germanic lore and the great
battles of Zeus with the Titans in the yavana world. In this context
some hymns of the early Germanic folk are very reminiscent of the
mantras of shaunaka or vAmadeva:
A hymn to Thor by Vetrlidi Summarlidason:

You smashed the limbs of Leiku, You bashed Thrivaldi
You knocked down Starkad, you trod Gjalp dead under foot.

A hymn to Thor by Thorbjorn Disarskald:
Your Mjollnir rang on Keila’s skull, you crushed the body of
Kjallandi,
you had killed Lut and Leidi, you made blood flow from Buseyra
you finished Hengjankapta, Hyrrokin died before that
earlier the dusky Svivor was robbed of her life.

Here is a hymn of a Germanic priestess Steinunn to the great god Thor
in response to a Christian missionary trying to convert the pagans.
She invokes Thor (who as the thunderer) destroyed the Saxon missionary
Thangbrand’s ship. You can again see deep impress of the Indra-like
deity on the pagan mind and the clear disdain for the fake god Christ
being peddled by the missionary (“The dasas who are anindra!”). In
many ways this is sort of a tragic hymn for it represents the last
bastion of our cultural kin in western Europe. But when we look back
we have many reasons to feel pleased that we are the last upholders of
the great Indo-European traditions that has elsewhere been obliterated
by the Abrahamic maniacs. It is important that we do not lose our
ultimately Indo-European identity in the very least to our internal
negationism and Rajaramism.

He that giant’s offspring slayeth
Broke the mew-field’s bison stout,
Thus the Gods, bell’s warder grieving,
Crushed the falcon of the strand;
To the courser of the causeway
Little good was that god Christ,
When Thor shattered ships to pieces
Gylfi’s reindeer Christ could not help.
Thangbrand’s vessel from her moorings,
Sea-king’s steed, Thor wrathful tore,
Shook and shattered all her timbers,
Hurled her broadside on the beach;
Ne’er again shall Viking’s snow-shoe,
On the briny billows glide,
For a storm by Thor awakened
Dashed the bark to splinters small.

> – Thor was the popular god. (Odin, the king of the gods of the
> Norse, was not widely worshipped, but instead primarily followed by
> the upper classes.) Indra is claimed by some to have been the main
> popular god among Vedist Hindus at some time

Indra clearly was indeed a very special deity for the Indo-Aryans. It
appears that the Aryans considered most of their deities to be
equipotent, but clearly the worship Indra was pinnacle of the core
Aryan religion. The Indra Mahotsava was the most important
public festival and just as with the Greeks, romans or germans the
best of the Indic votary poetry was aimed at Indra. The basic spirit
of Indra worship is far from gone amidst the lay Hindus. Much of
Indra has been transparently transfered to the hero cult of rAma the
ikshvAku.

> – Indra wields the vajra (thunderbolt). Thor wields the mjollnir
> (thunder-hammer).

There are more tied into this comparison. Thor’s mjollnir was forged
specially for him to slay the Jotunar just as tvashTA forged Indra’s
vajra for the slaying of the dAsas and dAnavas.

The nordics used the mjollnir is a rite called the hallowing rite
where they sanctified a bride during marriage or a new born with an
image of the hammer. This was called ‘vigja’. Now this is a cognate of
Roman vegeo- to invigorate, and descends from the same root as
Sanskrit vajra.

> >Stop peddling this myth of Hindu-Norseman bhai-bhai.

You and your like-minded fellows are free to remain profoundly deluded
in your negationist fervor. The opposition that you all are raising to
the Indo-European unification is only going to consigned to the
nearest historical trash-can at end of this confused generation of
Hindus, tossing about as a boat cutoff from its moorings. However in
the mean time it may cause a serious obstruction to the flow of
understanding of the ontology of the Hindu world to its lay
practioners.

> Again, aren’t these 2000 years apart and 10000 miles apart, and so
> either you have to consider these human societies to be as
> deterministic as chemical solutions, or you have to

Context, Context, please read more about other IE cultures with an
open mind. 2000 years and 10000 miles mean nothing in this context. It
is a product of probabilities: a smaller number than the individual
probabilities.

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